Post by Martinez on May 21, 2012 10:32:22 GMT -5
I'm going by Mark's old article and methodology when ranking the gams and will even compare the GMs that are still around from back then until now.
Here's Mark's old article:http://bbs2010.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=rcs&action=display&thread=9230&page=1
Here's a quick summary of Mark's rankings:
For starters Jiggy, Mops, APN, the North, Don, Tiger, Andrew, both Jeff's, Insane and Manas are no longer in this league that that's 11 out of 28 GMs ranked(Mark did not rank himself).
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Why: Well he hasn't done very much in his tenure with Philly. I don't recall him making any significant moves or even being remotely active. He's currently in his contract year and he's doing very little to improve his team. While, barring any incredible collapse he should have no problems making his CY he's currently sitting 10-5 but based on activity and career record he's easily bottom of the barrel.
Why: I was going to put the new guy here or 29. but I'm going to give the new guy the benefit of the doubt because really Kobe has done absolutely nothing relevant in his return. He was more active trolling the messageboards crying for a team then he is now that he finally has one. I'm sure he's still up to his old antics of ignoring PMs as well. Wasn't very good in the past and is even worse now, really horrible re-hire by Spencer.
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Why: I don't know very much about him but apparently he comes recommended by Styro and I don't think Styro is that much of an idiot to bring someone who sucks over. We'll see how he turns out.
Why: Is he even still in the league? I don't think anyone can argue that when Outlawz was active he was probably among the best in the league, but he's fallen off. His activity is the worst in the league and I think his lack of activity is mainly due in part due to his inability to pull off consecutive rape trades as was his trademark in the past. A washed up GM who keeps coming up to take up space.
Why: Despite finally making a Finals appearance Jah takes a four spot drop in my rankings. He hasn't done very much activity wise and he's still incredibly mediocre despite a finals apperance. Even if he makes a trade or two to improve his team who could probably be an elite team but he has never been proactive with trades and will sit on players for years and years.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 16[/center]
Why: I like andy and think he brings it activity wise but he's been pretty damn mediocre for the past 10-15 seasons. It seems he'll be good for one year and then horrible for 2 or 3 seasons, get in his CY build another great team and then be mediocre again until his next CY. The only thing keeping him from being lower in the rankings honestly is his activity.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 11[/center]
Why: Probably the biggest drop in GM rankings from Mark's old article, I think he may be the longest tenured GM without a championship or even a finals apperance. He's active behind the scenes, I assume, but very rarely adds anything significant to discussions. He's consistent, never is bad for long periods of times but just when you think he's heading in the right direction he makes a head scratching trade that takes him two steps back.
Why: Super active on the boards when he wants to be but hasn't shown much for it. At one point it looked like he was on his way to building a legitimate contender team but right now is in limbo. Needs to be able to show that he can be consistent if he ever wants to move up in the GM rankings but right now he isn't very good.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: I thought really hard about this and was going to put Biggie in front of Blue and Hype but I went with the longer track record in Blue and Hype who have been more consistent in the past than Biggie has been. Biggie has been much improved but has seemed to go back to his old ways the past couple of seasons.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: He isn't very active at all he took over a solidly built San Antonio team and hasn't done a whole lot with it. Lucked into the #1 pick in last years draft. He's a favorite of Haberman's but I just don't see it. Was he a good gm in the past? Sure, but it's a what have you done for me lately league and well he hasn't done very much.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 19[/center]
Why: I like Hype, I think he can be good when he's active and well he's been relatively active but he does drop down two spots because well he took over a very good Clippers team and hasn't done very much with it yet.
Why: I think HF has come a long way since Marks' GM rankings but still hasn't done anything incredibly significant like make a finals or anything. He's super active though and occasionally still builds very good teams. We'll see if he can ever jump that hurdle.
Why: Well well well, GAME ends up in the same spot as he did in Mark's rankings. GAME is super active and brings fun activity to the league. I don't think he will ever be a top-tier GM in this league or anything but he still builds consistently good teams and has done a pretty good job with his teams.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: Styro is another guy who's super active, builds consistently good teams, but never has gone past that hurdle of winning a championship. I think much like HF he'll make 3-4 really good trades and moves and then make one really bad one that hurts his team. I think he has a pretty good shot of moving up the rankings if he ever were to build a consistently great team every season but right now hasn't shown the ability to do so.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: I like John, I think he can be ok right now he's built a very great team and think will surprise alot of people this season. His teams fluctuate much like his activity up and down but I think he's a really underrated GM. I think if he keeps up how he's been GMing he can be a top 10 GM in the league easily.
Why: Easily the biggest jump in the rankings. Many of us find greeme's post and trade offers incredibly annoying but no one can argue about his activity and he's definitely a much better GM than what he was two years ago from Mark's article. The fact that he's been around for two years and has shown longevity in doing so speaks for itself. Still he has a habit of building a very good team and then totally dismantling it.
Why: I never thought DBW was an elite GM, I always thought he was very good but not elite. He has fallen off considerably since Mark's article but he has won titles before so there's no reason to think why he can't accomplish that again. He has talked about "retiring" if he ever failed his CY which I find incredibly sorry thing to do. You don't want to "retire" being at the bottom. Another GM who spoke of that was Play which is idiotic and is the main reason why I am going to rank him where I am in these rankings later on.
Why: Pig came back and was really good for a quite a few seasons but seems to have gone back to his routine lack of activity spurt. No denying Pig is a top 10 GM when he puts some effort into it. I feel pretty comfortable ranking him 13 right now.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: At first I had CC at 09, me at 11 and then I got to Jordan and decided to bump both me and CC up and Jordan all the way down to 11. I think when he's good, he's great but he's not on the level activity wise as me and CC are and when it comes to recent success one can make an arguement that both me and CC are on the same level but we get the bump due to activity. I think Jordan is very active at times but not always and his teams haven't been anytihng special the past 3-4 seasons.
Why: I was 12 then and I am fine ranking myself 12 now, even though I can easily make a case for top 10 GM ahead of guys like CC and Jordan. Mark summed up everytihng in his article and I also now own a champonship to boot. *after I got to 10 I decided to bump me and CC up.
Why: I think he's done a really good job in his new tenure. He's won a championship and has been consistent for quite a few seasons too. Activity wise he's always solid although he hasn't been as active as he has been in the past. He left the Cleveland Cavaliers in a shitty state with the Willis Reed trade but thankfully I was able to clean that up. We'll see what he can do with a very good Warriors team he was handed.
This is where it gets tough and I've been going back and forth the whole time with the top 10
Why: I think aar has also come a long way from Mark's article. He's infinitely better activity wise nowadays then he was back in 2010 and he's a much better GM as well. I think if Aar can win another championship in the East now he will move up to Elite status in the future. Mark was really down on him back then but no denying Aar is a very good GM.
Here's Mark's old article:http://bbs2010.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=rcs&action=display&thread=9230&page=1
Here's a quick summary of Mark's rankings:
28. Greeme 27. Jiggy 26. Mops 25. ApnAndrew 24. TheNorth 23. HF 22. Don 21. JAH 20. Tiger 19. Hype 18. Game 17. Andrew 16. Andy 15. Aar 14. Jeff(NC Squad) 13.Jeff Korea 12. Martinez 11. Greg 10. DBW 09. Insane 08. Basone 07. Manas 06. DJ 05. Haberman 04. Skillz 03. Broph 02. Nanz 01. Play
For starters Jiggy, Mops, APN, the North, Don, Tiger, Andrew, both Jeff's, Insane and Manas are no longer in this league that that's 11 out of 28 GMs ranked(Mark did not rank himself).
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Awful: 29-26
29. Dewaynec
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A Why: Well he hasn't done very much in his tenure with Philly. I don't recall him making any significant moves or even being remotely active. He's currently in his contract year and he's doing very little to improve his team. While, barring any incredible collapse he should have no problems making his CY he's currently sitting 10-5 but based on activity and career record he's easily bottom of the barrel.
28. Kobe
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: I was going to put the new guy here or 29. but I'm going to give the new guy the benefit of the doubt because really Kobe has done absolutely nothing relevant in his return. He was more active trolling the messageboards crying for a team then he is now that he finally has one. I'm sure he's still up to his old antics of ignoring PMs as well. Wasn't very good in the past and is even worse now, really horrible re-hire by Spencer.
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27. the new guy
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: I don't know very much about him but apparently he comes recommended by Styro and I don't think Styro is that much of an idiot to bring someone who sucks over. We'll see how he turns out.
26. Outlawz
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: Is he even still in the league? I don't think anyone can argue that when Outlawz was active he was probably among the best in the league, but he's fallen off. His activity is the worst in the league and I think his lack of activity is mainly due in part due to his inability to pull off consecutive rape trades as was his trademark in the past. A washed up GM who keeps coming up to take up space.
Not the worst but not very good: 25-21
25. Jahallstar
Ranking on Mark's Article: 21
Ranking on Mark's Article: 21Why: Despite finally making a Finals appearance Jah takes a four spot drop in my rankings. He hasn't done very much activity wise and he's still incredibly mediocre despite a finals apperance. Even if he makes a trade or two to improve his team who could probably be an elite team but he has never been proactive with trades and will sit on players for years and years.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 16[/center]
Why: I like andy and think he brings it activity wise but he's been pretty damn mediocre for the past 10-15 seasons. It seems he'll be good for one year and then horrible for 2 or 3 seasons, get in his CY build another great team and then be mediocre again until his next CY. The only thing keeping him from being lower in the rankings honestly is his activity.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 11[/center]
Why: Probably the biggest drop in GM rankings from Mark's old article, I think he may be the longest tenured GM without a championship or even a finals apperance. He's active behind the scenes, I assume, but very rarely adds anything significant to discussions. He's consistent, never is bad for long periods of times but just when you think he's heading in the right direction he makes a head scratching trade that takes him two steps back.
22 Jay
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: Super active on the boards when he wants to be but hasn't shown much for it. At one point it looked like he was on his way to building a legitimate contender team but right now is in limbo. Needs to be able to show that he can be consistent if he ever wants to move up in the GM rankings but right now he isn't very good.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: I thought really hard about this and was going to put Biggie in front of Blue and Hype but I went with the longer track record in Blue and Hype who have been more consistent in the past than Biggie has been. Biggie has been much improved but has seemed to go back to his old ways the past couple of seasons.
Weak Activity and Worse Result: 20-19
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: He isn't very active at all he took over a solidly built San Antonio team and hasn't done a whole lot with it. Lucked into the #1 pick in last years draft. He's a favorite of Haberman's but I just don't see it. Was he a good gm in the past? Sure, but it's a what have you done for me lately league and well he hasn't done very much.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: 19[/center]
Why: I like Hype, I think he can be good when he's active and well he's been relatively active but he does drop down two spots because well he took over a very good Clippers team and hasn't done very much with it yet.
Interchangeable: 18-14:
18. HeatFlash
Ranking on Mark's Article: 23
Ranking on Mark's Article: 23Why: I think HF has come a long way since Marks' GM rankings but still hasn't done anything incredibly significant like make a finals or anything. He's super active though and occasionally still builds very good teams. We'll see if he can ever jump that hurdle.
17. Game
Ranking on Mark's Article: 18
Ranking on Mark's Article: 18Why: Well well well, GAME ends up in the same spot as he did in Mark's rankings. GAME is super active and brings fun activity to the league. I don't think he will ever be a top-tier GM in this league or anything but he still builds consistently good teams and has done a pretty good job with his teams.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: Styro is another guy who's super active, builds consistently good teams, but never has gone past that hurdle of winning a championship. I think much like HF he'll make 3-4 really good trades and moves and then make one really bad one that hurts his team. I think he has a pretty good shot of moving up the rankings if he ever were to build a consistently great team every season but right now hasn't shown the ability to do so.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: I like John, I think he can be ok right now he's built a very great team and think will surprise alot of people this season. His teams fluctuate much like his activity up and down but I think he's a really underrated GM. I think if he keeps up how he's been GMing he can be a top 10 GM in the league easily.
14. Greeme
Ranking on Mark's Article: 28
Ranking on Mark's Article: 28Why: Easily the biggest jump in the rankings. Many of us find greeme's post and trade offers incredibly annoying but no one can argue about his activity and he's definitely a much better GM than what he was two years ago from Mark's article. The fact that he's been around for two years and has shown longevity in doing so speaks for itself. Still he has a habit of building a very good team and then totally dismantling it.
Above Average: 13-09
13. DBW
Ranking on Mark's Article: 10
Ranking on Mark's Article: 10Why: I never thought DBW was an elite GM, I always thought he was very good but not elite. He has fallen off considerably since Mark's article but he has won titles before so there's no reason to think why he can't accomplish that again. He has talked about "retiring" if he ever failed his CY which I find incredibly sorry thing to do. You don't want to "retire" being at the bottom. Another GM who spoke of that was Play which is idiotic and is the main reason why I am going to rank him where I am in these rankings later on.
12. Pig
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: Pig came back and was really good for a quite a few seasons but seems to have gone back to his routine lack of activity spurt. No denying Pig is a top 10 GM when he puts some effort into it. I feel pretty comfortable ranking him 13 right now.
[/img]Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A[/center]
Why: At first I had CC at 09, me at 11 and then I got to Jordan and decided to bump both me and CC up and Jordan all the way down to 11. I think when he's good, he's great but he's not on the level activity wise as me and CC are and when it comes to recent success one can make an arguement that both me and CC are on the same level but we get the bump due to activity. I think Jordan is very active at times but not always and his teams haven't been anytihng special the past 3-4 seasons.
10. Me
Ranking on Mark's Article: 12
Ranking on Mark's Article: 12Why: I was 12 then and I am fine ranking myself 12 now, even though I can easily make a case for top 10 GM ahead of guys like CC and Jordan. Mark summed up everytihng in his article and I also now own a champonship to boot. *after I got to 10 I decided to bump me and CC up.
09. CC
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article: N/AWhy: I think he's done a really good job in his new tenure. He's won a championship and has been consistent for quite a few seasons too. Activity wise he's always solid although he hasn't been as active as he has been in the past. He left the Cleveland Cavaliers in a shitty state with the Willis Reed trade but thankfully I was able to clean that up. We'll see what he can do with a very good Warriors team he was handed.
Very Good GMs: 08-06
This is where it gets tough and I've been going back and forth the whole time with the top 10
08. Aar
Ranking on Mark's Article: 15
Ranking on Mark's Article: 15Why: I think aar has also come a long way from Mark's article. He's infinitely better activity wise nowadays then he was back in 2010 and he's a much better GM as well. I think if Aar can win another championship in the East now he will move up to Elite status in the future. Mark was really down on him back then but no denying Aar is a very good GM.
07. Nanz
Ranking on Mark's Article: 02[/center
Why: Not as active as he was in the past, but still a daily poster. He;s not the #2 GM in the league at this point anymore but easily top 10. He was really bad for a few seasons but has turned it back up in the last couple of seasons. Will he ever be elite again? I doubt it, but he's good enough now to be a top 10 GM easily.
Why: I really think Broph should be higher but I can't put him in elite status without ignoring the fact that he's done absolutely nothing in the past few seasons. Many would argue he left the Milwaukee Bucks in not very great shape when he took over Portland despite his Bucks landing Bill Walton. Still, like Aar, I think if he ends up winning a title out West he moves easily back up to elite status.
Why:(I am going to copy and past Marks' exact words because hey, they are true to the fact. I will add that Skillz has fallen off again and really think he shouldn't be on Borderline Eltie but he's been so good consistently in regular season I can't drop him down )
I don’t like his style at all but it works. He very rarely tanks and when he wins it’s generally 50+ type seasons. He does a great job of making his future picks valueless. I don’t like the nonstop trading but he does a fantastic job making it work.
Why: I think DJ adds nothing to the league. If he were to quit today not a single person would pay any mind but his incredible lack of inactivity with posting or adding anything relevant to the league is easily surpassed by his ability to quietly build championship teams. While DJ does sit on players and teams for many seasons, unlike Jah, he does make a move or two to compete. He never takes a bad trade that goes against him, which makes him impossible to trade with but it works.
Why: I thought back then ranking him 5 was high, but ranking him 4 right now is about right. I think he's about to hit a pretty bad stretch with Aar owning his picks and his team being very old and mediocre right now, though, he's probably another championship away from being in elite status.
Why:Talks of quitting if he loses out on his CY easily no question bump him down to #2. A guy who I'd consider probably one of the best BBS Gm's of all-time talking about going out like a little bitch is something I just can't stomach to read. I think he's so much better than Repole. Repole probably lucked into two championships, Play has done it with no gimmicks and on a consistent basis. I really hope Play regains form and completely shuts down Repole.
Why: There's no one touching him right now, gimmicks or not, he's built one of the best teams BBS has ever seen. Bingo Smith is incredible. I still think he's a bit overrated but he's winning titles and that's all that really matters at this point. Hands down best GM in the league at this point.
Ranking on Mark's Article: 02[/centerWhy: Not as active as he was in the past, but still a daily poster. He;s not the #2 GM in the league at this point anymore but easily top 10. He was really bad for a few seasons but has turned it back up in the last couple of seasons. Will he ever be elite again? I doubt it, but he's good enough now to be a top 10 GM easily.
06. broph
Ranking on Mark's Article: 3
Ranking on Mark's Article: 3Why: I really think Broph should be higher but I can't put him in elite status without ignoring the fact that he's done absolutely nothing in the past few seasons. Many would argue he left the Milwaukee Bucks in not very great shape when he took over Portland despite his Bucks landing Bill Walton. Still, like Aar, I think if he ends up winning a title out West he moves easily back up to elite status.
Borderline Elite: 5-3
05. Skillz
Ranking on Mark's Article: 4
Ranking on Mark's Article: 4Why:(I am going to copy and past Marks' exact words because hey, they are true to the fact. I will add that Skillz has fallen off again and really think he shouldn't be on Borderline Eltie but he's been so good consistently in regular season I can't drop him down )
I don’t like his style at all but it works. He very rarely tanks and when he wins it’s generally 50+ type seasons. He does a great job of making his future picks valueless. I don’t like the nonstop trading but he does a fantastic job making it work.
4. DJ
Ranking on Mark's Article: 6
Ranking on Mark's Article: 6Why: I think DJ adds nothing to the league. If he were to quit today not a single person would pay any mind but his incredible lack of inactivity with posting or adding anything relevant to the league is easily surpassed by his ability to quietly build championship teams. While DJ does sit on players and teams for many seasons, unlike Jah, he does make a move or two to compete. He never takes a bad trade that goes against him, which makes him impossible to trade with but it works.
3. Aaron
Ranking on Mark's Article:5
Ranking on Mark's Article:5Why: I thought back then ranking him 5 was high, but ranking him 4 right now is about right. I think he's about to hit a pretty bad stretch with Aar owning his picks and his team being very old and mediocre right now, though, he's probably another championship away from being in elite status.
Cream of the Crop: 2-1
2.Play
Ranking on Mark's Article:1
Ranking on Mark's Article:1Why:Talks of quitting if he loses out on his CY easily no question bump him down to #2. A guy who I'd consider probably one of the best BBS Gm's of all-time talking about going out like a little bitch is something I just can't stomach to read. I think he's so much better than Repole. Repole probably lucked into two championships, Play has done it with no gimmicks and on a consistent basis. I really hope Play regains form and completely shuts down Repole.
1.Repole
Ranking on Mark's Article:N/A
Ranking on Mark's Article:N/AWhy: There's no one touching him right now, gimmicks or not, he's built one of the best teams BBS has ever seen. Bingo Smith is incredible. I still think he's a bit overrated but he's winning titles and that's all that really matters at this point. Hands down best GM in the league at this point.
